A FASTER way of dealing with problem pupils, with support for teachers who have difficulties in class, is needed to restore discipline in Tayside and Fife schools, retired teachers told The Courier last night.

The present system, they said, appeared designed to shelter those at the top of the education ladder from having to deal with disciplinary problems, by slowing the process down to such an extent that incidents were simply left to fizzle out.

The Courier’s decision to highlight the issues raised by the conviction for assault of Dundee teacher Mike Barile was also praised, with one ex-teacher calling it “courageous and correct.”

Comments came in from readers keen to voice their support for Mr Barile, who remains suspended from his job pending an inquiry by Dundee City Council’s education department.

He has also decided to appeal against his two convictions for assault that followed his trial at the sheriff court last week.

Among those most eager to comment on his case were former teachers who sympathised with the problems Mr Barile appeared to encounter on an almost daily basis, in trying to maintain order in the face of disruptive behaviour by some pupils.

Retired Waid Academy physics teacher George McIntosh said he gave up supply teaching in April, having had enough of the behaviour of teenage pupils.

Mr McIntosh said he had initially decided to take early retirement because of disciplinary issues that left him so shaken that he consulted his doctor.

He said, “You don’t get the support in classrooms that you should get.

“There’s an implication that if you’re having problems then it’s your own fault.

“It comes from the head teacher down. I had a boy standing behind me making rude and sexually suggestive actions.

“I took him along to the depute head but nothing was done because I had no witnesses although I’d seen the boy myself,” he added.

“Some head teachers are useless. They talk about discipline but do nothing.

“Decent children are having their education harmed because of the misbehaviour. I feel for the children and parents and teachers.”

Mr McIntosh said education authorities liked to keep hidden the “very high” level of sickness among teachers.

When he taught as a supply teacher at a Fife school there were six supply teachers out of 20 classrooms.

He added that the job was even harder for supply teachers but he was at least able to leave the classroom behind at the end of the day, unlike the permanent teaching staff.

He said, “I’d like to compliment The Courier on the articles they are running.

“Discipline is clearly out of hand and I retired at 58 because I’d had enough.

“I think The Courier’s cause is courageous and correct. The pendulum has swung too far the other way.

“The baddies are ruling the classrooms and teachers are having to spend so much of their time trying to discipline them that they can’t concentrate on teaching the other pupils who want to learn.”

James Wito, a retired teacher of 39 years experience and former colleague of Mr Barile’s at Madras College, said Mr Barile was neither a strict disciplinarian nor a soft-touch as a teacher.

He said the disciplinary procedures open to teachers were “so awkward as to be virtually useless.”

Mr Wito added, “The big problem is that they take forever.

“I’m not going to say we should bring back the belt but it was an immediate solution and we need a quicker way of dealing with indiscipline.

“Some of these systems seem designed to just keep the problem away from the people at the top of the education ladder.”

“There is a question mark against the people who are in charge both inside the schools and against the directors of education.

“Dundee’s director of education seems to have been particularly quiet on the issue.

“Even if children are excluded, the teacher has no say about when and if they return to the class.

Everyone—education officials, councillors, head teachers—is seen as more important than the man or woman doing the teaching.”

Retired primary school teacher Maggie Scott said indiscipline had to be tackled right at the very start of a child’s education.

Smaller classes with a maximum of 18 pupils should be the norm, with assistants in each class and parents involved wherever possible.

She said, “I know many schools already adopt these policies, but financially they are not always viable.

“In small classes, the teacher has much more time to spend with each pupil and to deal with any problems they might have—behavioural and educational.

“Many, but not all, pupils with discipline problems are those who need more teacher support academically.

“When they do not get it, they become disruptive, often through frustration or even boredom.”

Dundee reader Arthur McEwan commended The Courier for highlighting Mr Barile’s case and said all “decent-minded” parents as well as Mr Barile’s teaching colleagues should “combine to give him the backing and support he deserves.”

He added, “It seems clear from all reports that Mr Barile was endeavouring to maintain discipline within his classroom whilst some young thugs were intent on destroying the atmosphere of learning not only for themselves but for all the other children in the class.

“The parents of those thugs should be named and shamed but then again perhaps they could not care less.

“The fact that Mr Barile has been convicted of only a minor assault still gives out the wrong message to pupils, particularly those intending further disruption.

“The only disciplinary action available appears to be exclusion (eventually) but the thugs involved are more likely to see exclusion as a badge of honour than as a punishment, just like an ASBO.

“Rather than sacking Mr Barile, the education authority should give him and all other teachers of our children more support and powers to help educate those of the next generation who want to learn, rather than supporting thugs who are trying to destroy the ethos of the classroom and are harming the education of decent pupils who have a right to that education.”

Charles Comerford, who lives near Ladybank, said he and his wife taught their three sons—all now university graduates—that when they went to school the teacher was in loco parentis.

He said, “They understood that and gave the teacher the same respect they gave us. In my experience, there are a lot of parents who should think about that.

“I think Mr Barile has been given the short end of the stick because of a weak-kneed lot who are not prepared to stand up against bad parents.

“I think the people in charge should back Mr Barile and shouldn’t be punishing him at all.”

However, there was one message of dissent from Fife reader Claire Jarvis, who said that Mr Barile’s backers appeared to “yearn for the days where the promise of violence and physical abuse protected teachers.”

She said she did not believe that the use of the belt against young and almost certainly vulnerable children did anything to solve trouble-making, at best hiding the effects of the problem.

Ms Jarvis suggested that perhaps a new style of teaching is needed to enable teachers to connect with all pupils in the class.

She said, “Hitting a child that isn’t your own doesn’t do a thing to solve the motives behind their actions.

“I also agree in part that there are many layers to discipline in schools but I don’t believe that a politician writing a new piece of legislation will stop the daughter of an alcoholic causing a fuss in biology because she wants a bit of attention.

“I don’t believe that senior management printing up 50 brightly-coloured posters emphasising the ground rules will do anything to help the undiagnosed dyslexic in the back row, who’s shouting abuse at his teacher, because he doesn’t understand what is written on the blackboard,” she added.

“A long time ago, our whole year was taking part in a study skills day. One of the tasks was to determine what type of learner you were.

“The results really got me thinking. Everybody who was a visual learner had to put their hands up.

“You saw three or four hands all belonging to the classroom swots (myself included)…and the teacher. Everybody who was an audio learner—the majority of the class—(were) the nice but academically average strata.

She added, “That small survey got me thinking then. It raises even more questions now that I’m older.

“Why is it that these ‘feral’ children wish to misbehave in class? Could the primary fault lie with the teachers for not suitably engaging them during the lessons?

“Some of the worst were the most docile and well- behaved pupils in our home economics class—a ‘hands-on’ subject.

“The results of that ‘surv- ey’ hint that if the majority of teachers are a certain type of learner, that’s the way they conduct lessons.

“Could the primary fault lie with the teachers for not giving (the) disadvantaged enough of the correct attention, for simply not respecting and caring enough?

“Or perhaps the problem originates from the way that these teachers were taught their trade?”